Slashdot Log In
Ask Kevin Mitnick
Posted by
Roblimo
on Mon Jan 20, 2003 12:00 PM
from the he's-as-free-as-a-bird-now dept.
from the he's-as-free-as-a-bird-now dept.
Okay, Kevin Mitnick is getting back online and can start taking email tomorrow, January 21. We've spoken with Kevin by phone, and he agrees that a Slashdot interview is a fine way to help celebrate his return to the Internet, especially since he has a book to sell and a consulting business to build. (Don't forget: Kevin hasn't been able to make much money for a number of years, and has a lot of lost time to make up for.) One question per post, please. We'll email Kevin 10 of the highest-moderated questions, and post his answers shortly after he gets them to us.
This discussion has been archived.
No new comments can be posted.
Ask Kevin Mitnick
|
Log In/Create an Account
| Top
| 839 comments
(Spill at 50!) | Index Only
| Search Discussion
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
No he's been waiting for (Score:5, Funny)
I bet his email account is full! 100,000 spams just waiting for him to return...
How about.... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:How about.... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:How about.... (Score:5, Funny)
I see it going something like this:
TechTV Host: Okay Kevin, here's your computer, you have the controls. You said you were thinking about browsing a few web sites?
Kevin: Yes. I think I'd like to try Yahoo.
Kevin: Ah. Here we go. Hmm. This is odd, it doesn't look like the screenshots I've seen in magazines...
Kevin displays shock and surprise.
Kevin: It looks like a hundred pages of CREDIT CARD NUMBERS! Hey, what's going on!?!
Cops bust through the doors, comedy ensues.
Re:How about.... (Score:5, Funny)
Delete spam. Tons of spam.
No Offense meant, but.. (Score:5, Insightful)
he has a book to sell and a consulting business to build. (Don't forget: Kevin hasn't been able to make much money for a number of years, and has a lot of lost time to make up for.)
Knowing all this as the result of your choice, would you choose this path again? If so, why?
Re:No Offense meant, but.. (Score:5, Insightful)
Did he choose to be the poster-boy of government corruption when it comes to prosecution of technology-related case? I don't think so.
You're the type of person who would ask Skylarov why he chose to come to the U.S. to speak at a technology conference.
What Really Happened (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:No Offense meant, but.. (Score:5, Insightful)
On the contrary, I applaud Dimitri Sklyarov and feel his work was construct, in the face of unjust legislation the USA exports and tries to exert on other peoples. It should be the choice of each sovereign nation to determine the extent of copyright/patent protection to inventors. One country, such as the USA, may attempt to hold all others in thrall as long as the life of intellectual property protection.
Besides, Kevin didn't attempt to bypass electronic IP safeguards, except as the DMCA may regard hacking. He revealed the swisscheese security of information systems in their infancy. He made people afraid, powerful people. We already, well most of us, are aware what sort of democracy-for-sale the Congress and Administration are, when their friends sneeze, they catch cold, and act within or without the law. It's a matter for the defendant to pry him/herself out of such a mess. As often as such examples play it's remarkable anyone wants to open themselves to such harrassment, particularly without alerting the ACLU or some group ahead of time that they intend to demonstrate how unjust the system is, in whole or part.
Anyone remember the 414's? A group of young men in the Milwaukee area who, when caught breaking into DEC systems wanted to sell movie rights? It wasn't too hard to figure how they did it, hell, I was admin on a DEC system and there were default passwords and field service passwords easy enough to guess. You just had to be bored and stupid enough to go trespassing.
I have plenty of sympathy for those treated unjustly, but those who go alone to spread fear among powerful interests are no more clever than a swimmer dogpaddling around in a shark tank.
Re:No Offense meant, but.. (Score:5, Insightful)
Actually (a little googleing reveals that) in many instances he DID - or rather his lawyers did. The trial kept getting delayed due to it's complexity - often at the request of HIS lawyers. Hiring and firing three different lawyers doesn't usually speed things up any either (though I'll grant you it is possible they were incompetant - but the real possiblity exists their client was part of their problem). As for being denied bail that whole time - well that is sort of a natural penalty for running & continuing to commit the same crimes while on the run - for some reason people just don't trust you not to it again. Wasting time in useless appeals to GET bail when no sane judge would give it to you is just another thing that drags out the time you spend waiting for trial.
I don't think he chose to have the software he downloaded (and did not distribute) valued at an amount way beyond reality because the Feds said to.
And they should have been valued at less because he & his lawyers said so? I have no idea what the real value of the damage he caused to various systems was or the value of the information he stole. I doubt HE knows it's value. I am sure his victims and the prosecution exagerated it's value. On the other hand it is not difficult at ALL to assume that the value was quite significant. Big companies worth many billions of dollars keep stuff on their computers that really do have multi-million dollar values to those companies. Those where the kinds of companies he liked to hack and the kind of information he liked to steal BECAUSE he wanted to be a big deal and make a big splash. Well he did.
I don't think he chose to have terms of his probation which kept him from using his First Amendment rights
While convicts have rights the whole point of being a convict is having certain rights taken away. As for his specifically first amendment rights - I don't know of any instance during his sentence when the government established a religion for him, forbade him to excersise his own, forbade him to speak, talk to the (or even run a) press, assemble peacably or petition the government to redress his greavances (this last I think he excersiced far more than most of us) Being forbidden to use a computer after being convicted 4 or 5 times (on multiple counts each time) of computer fraud & abuse is not much different from being forbidden to own a gun after being convicted of a gun crime. Being forbidden to use a tool that you only seem adept at using criminally seems appropriate and fitting not cruel nor unusual. Having himself argued in court before that he was compulsive and unable to control himself probably didn't help his case any on this point.
Did he choose to be the poster-boy of government corruption when it comes to prosecution of technology-related case
After being caught and convicted on numerous prior occasions and being dealt with fairly leniently by the courts at first - then doing the same thing again *while on probabation* - then running when a warrant is issued - then continuing to commit the same high profile crimes while on the run IS asking for it.
Yes, there are murderers that have been dealt with less harshly. That's a GREAT argument for harsher treatment of murderers IMO than for more lenient treatment of multiple offense fraud artist fugitives. All the time I hear on
What do you say? (Score:5, Interesting)
Priorities (Score:5, Interesting)
Anyone here who wouldn't be in trouble if every one of their computer and copyright related "offenses" came to light can throw the first stone. Ever downloaded an unlicensed MP3 plugin for Redhat 8? Ever renamed irc to emacs to violate a school policy on computer use?
Thoughts (Score:5, Interesting)
Or is is the old, I just gotta do this feeling?
Re:Thoughts (Score:5, Interesting)
http://www.defensivethinking.com/ [defensivethinking.com]
He's going to be spending some time explaining his methods -- as opposed to using them.
Life Without the Internet (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Life Without the Internet (Score:5, Informative)
Although he cannot use the internet himself, he is allowed to observe other people who are using it, and talk about the webpage as they view it. Technically he has not been allowed to direct the persone browsing the web, but they sort of work around that via a series of "yes-no" questions.
Re:Life Without the Internet - similar... (Score:5, Interesting)
Did spending an extensive period of time away from computers make you realize that you might just move away one day? or are you still fascinated like the first geek was?
What's Different? (Score:5, Interesting)
-theGreater Ponderer.
Your finest moment in court (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Your finest moment in court (Score:5, Interesting)
When you had your weekend radio show on KFI in Los Angeles, you had many stories that brought about changes in your tone, such as experiments with "drive thru"s involving intercepting and overriding the employees such that you could speak directly with the customer from a distance away. While many would argue (and I would certainly agree) that this isn't a technical marvel, it is pretty damn funny.
So, my question is: everyone knows the big things you've done that you've been punished for, what about the little things you've done that you look back on and smile about?
Yes? (Score:5, Interesting)
Do you feel... (Score:5, Interesting)
Skill sets? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Skill sets? (Score:5, Interesting)
(these skill having to do with computers - even though you have not had access to computers during this time)
Re:Skill sets? (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Can't earn money? (Score:4, Insightful)
I suppose the Rosenberg's were good spys and Dahmer was a good serial killer too huh?
In Mitnick's "line of work" as it were, being good means NOT getting caught.
I honestly don't see why so many people like us lift Mitnick up to some hero-like status. He was dumb. He wasn't a good hacker, and what he did hack he handled really stupidly. And that's what got him caught, plain and simple. He's now going to make a living on his name.
Re:Can't earn money? (Score:5, Funny)
How do you find it? (Score:5, Interesting)
What do you think of todays internet?
Re:How do you find it? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:How do you find it? (Score:5, Insightful)
The hot issue for many of us concerns the idea of Fair Use, copyright, and copyright enforcment. Government regulations have been changed and are changing in favor of the same kinds of large corporations that claimed huge damages against you during your less than ideal experiance with the Judidical System.
My question is this. What are your thoughts on the continued expansion of corporate copyright enforcement rights, including the legalization of some of the techniques you were convicted of using?
Do you trust corporate america to weild the tools you've used and helped pioneer and what if any regulation do you consider both accecptable and feasable?
Which OS? (Score:5, Interesting)
Hmmm, maybe you will try them all? You are a sneaky one.
So... (Score:4, Interesting)
Honestly, though. Do you think your return to the internet should be a 'celebration'? You -did- break the law, why should we be happy you are back on the saddle again?
Scapegoat Sweepstakes? (Score:5, Interesting)
How many of the charges brought against you were unfair? What do you feel would have been a fair set of charges to levy against you?
Re:Scapegoat Sweepstakes? (Score:5, Interesting)
Do you hold ill will towards the friend you had in the early days that you bullied into giving you mainframe access at his work? I read in the book Hackers that you not only bullied him into letting you into his workplace after-hours, but you would make him drive you around and buy you Fatburgers. How much of this account is true?
The more things change... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:The more things change... (Score:5, Interesting)
Q:
The slammer (Score:5, Interesting)
Welcome back.
Re:The slammer (Score:5, Funny)
Re:The slammer (Score:5, Funny)
Advice (Score:5, Funny)
Simple as that
Your wrongs... (Score:5, Interesting)
Free Kevin! (Score:5, Interesting)
Was Your Penalty Fair and Will It Deter? (Score:5, Insightful)
Future vs Past (Score:5, Interesting)
How do you see yourself? (Score:5, Insightful)
In what light and or combination of these types do you see yourself now, is that different from how you were 20 years ago, and do you see yourself as a champion of these things in the future or do you intend to just mix back into society and get a "normal" life back (after your book of course)?
The speed of change (Score:5, Interesting)
As a side note, if you're interested in game programming, let me know!!
Trepidation (Score:3, Interesting)
Prison Life (Score:5, Interesting)
still possible (Score:5, Interesting)
clueful authorities? (Score:5, Interesting)
>How clueful are they?
>In your opinion, how did the each party (prosecution, your lawyer, and most
>important - the judge) look when it came to their understanding of
>technology? Did they know every nook and cranny, or seem lost in a maze of
>confusion? Do you think an understanding of the issues in question was a
>significant factor in court proceedings?
I know you spoke of this briefly in that lost chapter of your book, in that the companies who said they were victimized significantly overstated their losses (and admitted to it), and the judge went beyond prosecution's suggestion for punishment. But I'm curious to know how competent you think the feds are in these types of legal matters.
For better or worse... (Score:5, Insightful)
Hacker Icon (Score:3, Insightful)
Philosophical changes (Score:5, Interesting)
Have your recent law-related experiences (for lack of a more elegant term) brought about any major philosophical changes in your life ? By this, I mean not necessarily computer related changes, but in all aspects of your perception of the world.
Did you know you'd get caught? (Score:5, Interesting)
I guess what I'm most curious about is whether you knew the risks and took them anyway, or whether you thought you were covering your tracks and that the risks were minimal. It would be interesting to know if you knew you'd eventually get busted or whether you thought you were relatively "safe" from discovery.
question (Score:5, Interesting)
The Most Important Question of All (Score:4, Interesting)
What are your thoughts about TCPA Initiative / Palladium? Do you see it as a destructive force in the computing industry?
Seeing.. (Score:5, Interesting)
Maeryk
Was signing away your rights vs early trial (Score:5, Interesting)
I enjoyed your bio, it's a pitty it was cut from your book.
Can you tell me why it was better to stay in prison and sign away your rights, than to go to trial early with a less prepared lawyer?
Weren't you just keeping yourself in prison longer that you should have been?
Do you really think that you would have got an even worse treatment if you went to trial earlier?
Question about Trust (Score:5, Interesting)
I realize that you may have put your cracking days behind you but can you really address the question of trust in the computer security industry.
How has your move into the security industry been recieved by the establishment, and how have you been dealing with the obvious question of you being trusted in the very area you manipulated.
Re:What are the ten worst Windows vulnerabilities? (Score:5, Insightful)
"What are the ten worst Linux vulnerabilities to hacking, how would you attack such systems, and what has to be done with Linux to prevent such vulnerabilities?"
Surely you don't actually believe that Linux is unhackable? Wouldn't finding out what Linux's weakest areas are and fixing them before Linux becomes widspread enough on "Dumb User" hardware that it becomes the next great hacking target?
Poor guy (Score:4, Funny)
I guess he'd know better if he'd actually read any Slashdot interviews lately.
How have things changed? (Score:3, Interesting)
Social Engineering (Score:5, Interesting)
Do you think that social engineering still plays as big a part now as it did in your heyday? Moreso maybe?
So how has it all changed? (Score:4, Interesting)
How is the 'net different now from the last time and are you going to miss it?
Do you think this will affect your job potential? (Score:4, Interesting)
Yes, I know it's only supposed to be one question per post, but I think these are pretty well related.
Re-Educating yourself for today's tech world. (Score:5, Interesting)
Now can we settle it once and for all? (Score:4, Funny)
Is it "cracker" or "hacker"?
Published Stories vs. Reality (Score:5, Interesting)
What's it like? (Score:5, Interesting)
You are a notable exception. What's it like being a rock star, and how great is it that you'll now be able to fully capitalize on your fame in the financial sense? Would you be in as promising a position today had you not run afoul of the law?
Why are we helping him build his business? (Score:3, Insightful)
When I was 13 I thought that cracking into systems was "kool." Now that I am an adult, I see that once a system has been compromised - even if it's just so that a smart kid can look around - it costs a fortune to be sure that a) the holes are closed, and b) the kid didn't do any damage.
He broke the law. Should we help him "make up for lost time" by helping him profit on his life experiences? I don't think so.
Let me give an example. Let's say that I am pro legalization of prostitution. (I'm not)
Before the legislators became "enlightened" on this issue (while it is still illegal) someone is convicted of being a pimp - should I make that person a poster-boy? Should I work to build a "how to be a pimp" consulting business, or promote a "pimping for dummies" book?
Kevin broke the law, and did his time. Can't he just get a straight job like the rest of us and move on? Why must he be a hero? Why must
I don't get it. Let it go. Kevin, please get a regular job and live like an ordinary citizen.
Respectfully,
Anomaly
Making that a question (Score:5, Interesting)
Mr. Mitnick:
There are some people who feel that it is unfair for you to use your reputation as an infamous cracker to sell books and build your new consulting business. They argue that you are being given a level of free publicity and exposure that other law-abiding citizens simply would not receive. How would you respond to these accusations? Do they concern you at all? Deep in your heart do you feel that it's unfair you are getting all this extra-special treatment but are willing to accept it anyhow because you need whatever help you can get? Do you feel that it's acceptable to accept some unusual help building your business because you were subject to equally unusual/extreme punishment?
Moderators: this is not a troll. I think this is a legitimate question that many people here would like answered.
GMD
When given lemons make lemonade (Score:5, Insightful)
Mitnick has knowledge and skills that will make him a productive part of society. The area he's promoting himself in is a legitimate legal business so why shouldn't we get behind him and support him. This would constitute a "regular job" - unless you mean flipping burgers or selling clothes at the gap, or maybe insurance salesperson. There are plenty of former criminals in areas of expertise that relate directly to their original crimes. Their knowledge is often very helpful in stopping future crimes and in showing how people can reform and rebuild their lives after having made mistakes.
Mitnick served out the punishment given by the state and now he should be allowed to live his life unencumbered by that "criminal" title. This includes seeking ANY gainful employment he can find.
I feel that society does have an obligation to help people who we've allowed to be mistreated.
The problem with the justice system today is:
1. They bend a little too much to the corporate will.
2. Punishment is never really centered around "correction" even though people are remanded to the "Department of Corrections".
3. There's no procedure for quick and fair correction of mistakes (i.e. false imprisonment, misshandling, etc.) Most compensation has to be gained via lawsuit. False judgements can stay with a person for life, damaging not only their mental health but their future job prospects and personal relationships.
4. Too much stock is put into conviction rates and not enough in to quality of prosecution and/or honesty in prosecution.
5. Justices allow stretching the word and spirit of the law in order to help prosecutions of people not exactly covered under existing laws. I.E. Some people get prosecuted under RICO when their crime has nothing to do with it.
6. Prosecutors withholding charges in order to pursue additional charges should they lose in the first round - an attempt to circumvent double jeopardy rules. (i.e. I murder someone during a robbery - the evidence is fairly thin, so I'm prosecuted for Murder (alone). When I'm acquitted the prosecution charges on attempted robbery, weapons charges or one of the many other charges that they can dig out that might have stronger evidence. The possibility of prosecution might loom for years, along with the stigma of "suspect".)
7. The ability to punish/pursue a suspect through (ab)use of the media. ("person of interest"). Placing pressure on a subject via media "leaks" or press releases that lead the public to believe certain things about a person. While not exactly lies we all know that it's the prosecution using the media to manipulate the public against a SUSPECTED criminal. (defense and prosecution should be barred (ethics) from using the media as a tool against the other side.) Remember INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY.
Out of the Loop (Score:5, Interesting)
How did you/do you stay current on technologies without actual experience, and was it difficult without having an opportunity to put theory into practice?
Security Precautions (Score:5, Interesting)
Big question (Score:5, Funny)
Thanks in advance!
Re:Big question (Score:5, Interesting)
ROFLMAO.
A half-serious question: "If the statute of limitations has expired, and/or your lawyers think you're safe from double jeopardy... What was the passphrase to all those files the DoJ couldn't (or wouldn't admit to being able to) decrypt after all these years?"
Social Engineering (Score:5, Interesting)
Do you have any stories about Social Engineering gone awry? That is, a situation where the mark saw right through your ruse and you just couldn't pull it off.
Welcome back Kevin (Score:5, Interesting)
There was a very interesting (and well balanced) program about you I saw in England a while ago, and in it it mentioned that you were put into solitary confinement (AFAIK) for 6 months, and weren't allowed to use (let alone go near) a telephone under the misaligned fear that you could "blow up the country with one call".
My question is: How does it make you feel when there are such ignorant and misinformed people who are in a position of authority (i.e. judges, police, government) and are there any ways in which you can use your experience to change these attitudes/problems for the good?
Did rehabilitation work? (Score:5, Interesting)
My question is therefore, "Did you learn that it is wrong to intentionally destroy others' work for your own amusement? If so, what part of the punishment was most effective? And, if not, what additional punishment might have changed your mind?"
This is a serious question. I'm not just trolling.
Do u have a keygen for Wind0zes xp? (Score:5, Interesting)
How Do You Plan on Getting Up to Speed? (Score:5, Interesting)
Don't get me wrong, but you can only advise people on social engineering and easy passwords for so long...what kind of knowledge did you already have on PKI, VPNs, Firewalls, IDSes? There seems to be so much that has changed that just a cursory understanding of the principles behind these technologies does not seem sufficient to serve as a consultant (or at least one I would pay for)
Since so much has changed radically in the last few years, how have you kept up or do you plan to keep up at the moment? I can't see just reading a book on the latest OS specs and administrative tasks and being able to consult on them without hands on experience, and in your case you have quite a few years of language, os, security, and other operational technology advances to get up to speed with, etc.
So basically....what's you game plan to get back to a modern day equivalent of the proficiency you had several years ago?
Time Flies (Score:5, Interesting)
Yours is a unique perspective - almost like a kid that has had full run of the candy store and was taken outside and forced to watch (face pressed to the glass). Now you're allowed back in to a drastically changed candy landscape. (Pardon the candy analogy, but I'm fond of sugary things).
In your opinion, what technology has changed the greatest since you were actively involved in the scene?
What will be your primary technology focus when you get back online - in terms of getting back up to speed?
Do you feel intimidated at the prospect of catching up on so many things? Are there areas that you will simply ignore out of necessity but would like to learn more about if you had the time?
Do you have any desire to hack just for the joy of hacking/discovery or have you been turned off of that in light of the consequences?
Thank you for your answers and welcome back!
public opinion (Score:5, Interesting)
Addiction (Score:5, Interesting)
crime or condition (Score:3, Insightful)
What kind of computer will you be using? (Score:3, Interesting)
Unauthorized? (Score:5, Funny)
F*ck all these questions (Score:3, Interesting)
or if I was a lawyer:
"Imagine a person in your situation. How would they get even?"
What we're all dying to know ;-) (Score:3, Interesting)
- Hackers
, which I was written with some interestingly similar parallels to your own life...Las Vegas and the PBX (Score:5, Interesting)
What was the story behind your part that trial? (And how much stuff do you have in storage?)
Do you still have skills? (Score:5, Interesting)
a question for Kevin (Score:3, Interesting)
What have you learned about selling yourself in this environment to overcome the objectections about your criminal convictions that might be of use to other slashdotters?
Side Note: some of us slashdotters have minor run ins with law in our past that coudl obviously if they are using computer kislls within the law make use of what you have learned in this area, Kevin..
What were you thinking? (Score:5, Interesting)
During your escapades which eventually landed you in hot water, you used the EFF account at The WELL to hide the files you stole from T. Shimomura. I'm still trying to figure out why the heck you did that. A simple "last" would have shown you that that was an active account, and you could have guessed that the user was probably technically savvy enough to notice the sudden spike in disk usage. Was that just an act of hacker hubris, or were you just not paying attention? Ultimately, it's what led to your downfall (FBI monitoring your keystrokes, live tracing of IP's) so I am well and truly curious.
-jim
Are you proud of what you did back then? (Score:3, Insightful)
What do you say to kids who think you're cool?
If the law were different many years ago... (Score:3, Insightful)
The scene (Score:3, Interesting)
You are now in a sense our Rip van Winkle in this regard, and I'd like to know what your initial impressions are about the status quo regarding attitudes towards security (now and then), and changes you've perceived in levels of implemented security (gained, of course, from reading, not practising:-) ), etc.
Describe our world for us as seen by someone who only knew it 8 years ago. Has the baby matured into something to be proud of?
Technological Rip Van Winkle (Score:5, Interesting)
I've been a hardcore programmer for the past 10 years, and even I find it difficult to keep up with all these new technologies, terms, etc, and I spend around 3 hours a night after work just dedicated to investigating new technologies.
Where you able to keep up with technology during your incarceration and probation period by just reading books, or were you even allowed to read books? How soon do you think it will take you to re-absorb enough knowledge and, more importantly, experience to make yourself useful in today's world?
Is a Consulting Business Really a Good Idea (TM) (Score:5, Interesting)
To be quite blunt, why would a corporation hire someone with a criminal history who hasn't touched a computer in 8 years?
With all that said, I do wish you the best of luck.
Setting an example (Score:3, Interesting)
In general, can you comment on the recent trends of "I just broke into your computer and stole all of your proprietary information, now hire me as a security consultant and pay me big bucks."
Should not the well-paying jobs in computer security be left to law-abiding citizens and not to this class of criminal?
Cracking for the government (Score:5, Interesting)
John Markoff (Score:5, Interesting)
Prison (Score:3, Interesting)
How about your personal life? (Score:5, Interesting)